Prince of Tennis

[xyj3ee]

http://manga.yuedu365.com/upload/L/1LilimKiss.jpg (http://manga.yuedu365.com/bookinfo/6708)

Saiki Takaya, a guy who is easily misunderstood, one day finds a flask containing the succubus Lilim. She is very attractive but, she also has the tendency to drain the life force out of people. She surprises the life out of him (literally) when she kisses him unconscious. The girl, Lilim, turns out to be a succubus who gains energy by kissing guys. Lilim then flies off for more "food," but returns later, saying that Takaya's life-energy was the "tastiest." From then, Lilim is accepted by ...

I found a website quick Update! Very good! !If you like the manga, you may go there!

Now share your links!
manga LINK>>>>>>> (http://manga.yuedu365.com/bookinfo/6708)

[pylar]

I locked this one too!

[MooL]

XXXholic and Tsubasa Resevoir Chronicle come to mind for sure. It's an anime/manga series by CLAMP. For one, those two series are intertwined, and then Tsubasa itself has characters from ALL of CLAMP's series (Cardcaptor Sakura, Chobits, X-1999, Tokyo Bablyon, etc..).


And they are fantastic!

[DarkSlayer]

And when he was fighting a hollow with Rukia he pulled out a pole, like 2,000 pounds, out of the ground like it was a toothpick.

Oh yeah...forgot about that.

*Points at Sub.Shinigami* Yeah, what they said!

[Princess Gheyfu]

Bandai Entertainment announces broadcast at NYAF
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/thumbnails/fit200x200/encyc/A6704-7.jpgThe Adult Swim (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/company.php?id=2514) network will be airing the Code Geass: Lelouch of the Rebellion (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=6704) military robot anime series in the United States. President Ken Iyadomi (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=267) of the anime distributor Bandai Entertainment (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/company.php?id=3) and the company's marketing associate Marti Rivera made this announcement at the New York Anime Festival (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2007-12-08/code-geass-to-air-on-adult-swim-in-usa#) panel for the anime on Saturday. Bandai Entertainment announced that it acquired (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2007-07-21/bandai-goes-geass) the license to the first Code Geass series at the Otakon convention in July, and the animation company Sunrise (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/company.php?id=34) has announced (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2007-12-06/new-code-geass-tv-series-confirmed-for-spring-2008) this week that a new series will air in Japan in the spring of 2008.
Image © Sunrise/Project Geass, MBS (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/company.php?id=313)
Character Design (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=29963) © 2006 CLAMP (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=5765)

From: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2007-12-08/code-geass-to-air-on-adult-swim-in-usa


My opinion: If this runs side by side with Death Note, this will be an incredible ratings booster and anime ratings will soar like the FMA/Big-O 2 run. :)

[mthegreatone]

Lots of Moetan apperances in Hayate no Gotoku along with a character that looks alot like that afro dude from Excel Saga. Excel Saga also had lots of references including Kenshiro.

there's just a crapload of references in general in Hayate no Gotoku, not many with anime characters drawn on-screen though

[Alex26]

Death note on Sayonara Setsubou Sensei (or however thats spelled...).Light appears clearly for a few seconds there

Im pretty sure there were other references on that same anime, but only that one comes to mind right now

[VinScythe]

Here's another quote
Lelouch: Johnny Yong Bosch

C2 (CC): Kate Higgins

Kallen: Karen Strassman

Suzaku Kururugi: Yuri Lowenthal

Lloyd: Liam O'Brien

Tohdoh: Steve Blum

Bartley: Peter Spellos

Clovis: Dave Wittenberg

Emperor: Michael McConnohie

Shirley: Amy Kincaid

Milly: Julie Ann Taylor

Nina & Sayoko: Kim Mai Guest

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/convention/2007/code-geass


Bosch doesn't strike me as a dark character. He certainly carries the arrogance.
I'll be shocked to see he makes another good job.

My opinion: If this runs side by side with Death Note, this will be an incredible ratings booster and anime ratings will soar like the FMA/Big-O 2 run. :)
Well Death Note could use any help it can get, at the moment its weekly ratings are doing worse than the average Bleach.

I'm sure the audience will appreciate another mech show, thought the previous Eureka 7 didn't hit is targeted audience.
Bleh as long as Gurren Lagann isn't the mix, you can't even begin to talk about the revolutionary DBZ/Gundam Wing(pre AS).
They'd be on crack to run back-to-back mech show premieres.

[Princess Gheyfu]

Actually, DN is boasting very high success. The day it premiered, the ratings were in the late 500,000s AND online, the episode scored a magnificent 350,000 views, which adds up to a higher viewer count than the average Big O Season 2 episode, although recently it has dropped to the 500/400 thousands, its still doing well. Code Geass, tho, is getting alot more attention and is building an entire franchise before it even premieres, with merchandise, special focus booths a t the anime festival, among other things. IMO, it will be well prepared for its arrival, other than Death Note's sloppy entrance.

Also, I'm REALLY hoping they made a typo and Yuri plays Lelouch, and Bosch plays Suzaku.

[ninjabot]

Actually, Chad didn't get super strong until he began hanging around Ichigo, right? I mean, the whole reason anyone around Ichigo has powers is because of his spirit energy haveing an effect on the physical world. That's the reason captain's need limiters, because their sheer reiatsu could alter the physical plane.

Back when Chad was getting picked on for being a foreigner he wasn't super strong, just "big guy" strong. Martial artist strength trumps regular big-guy strength. Just ask Bruce Lee.

[craftyboy1]

I like Near because he has it all planned what he is going to do and what he would do in Kira's position and makes his move.

Also toys are AWESOME!

[craftyboy1]

Well Light gets a bit mad now and then and outbursts while thinking like Kira but inside his head he is usually mad but you can barely tell from the outside.

[craftyboy1]

Darn i knew where it was

[craftyboy1]

Yeah its going good then BAM! L is dead.

Tobi has a good idea tho.

[craftyboy1]

Yeah Watari needs to be english accent and Kira should be kinda deep.

DEATH NOTE ROCKS!

[craftyboy1]

I wouldnt destroy it but i wouldnt use it either. It would be my sumtin sumtin for if i was being hunted by i dunno a killer?

[KillerPuma]

I support Kira, I think that is the point of the story. To get the audience to want to cheer on the bad guy (Yagami Light).

[Undying]

Actually, Chad didn't get super strong until he began hanging around Ichigo, right? I mean, the whole reason anyone around Ichigo has powers is because of his spirit energy haveing an effect on the physical world. That's the reason captain's need limiters, because their sheer reiatsu could alter the physical plane.
Back when Chad was getting picked on for being a foreigner he wasn't super strong, just "big guy" strong. Martial artist strength trumps regular big-guy strength. Just ask Bruce Lee.
Uh, no, only his Super Special Awesome powers have to do with Ichigo, his physical strength shouldn't be affected by it (except it will be increased when he uses Puberty Power).

Otherwise, Chad can survive anything that hits him. And by that I mean including a motorbike accident, a steel beam falling on his head, etc.

And Chad can fight too, he's got the killer punches.

[CallouS]

I know that it was a good show. I very much enjoyed it.

[+KuSaKaBe+]

To be fair, Jack kinda got his ass kicked by that Blue Gatekeeper guy.

Yeah, that Gatekeeper purposely stopped kicking Jack's ass because he knew that Jack wasn't prepared to take him on. I actually liked that fight, even though Jack got the sh*t beaten out of him.

[VinScythe]

Actually, DN is boasting very high success. The day it premiered, the ratings were in the late 500,000s AND online, the episode scored a magnificent 350,000 views

One can't really tell anything from the online ratings since they really go nowhere(also why they were removed), so I wont talk about that (also seeing how Xavier premiered even higher).

For TV ratings, AS Saturdays are one sharp spike after another.
Mainly, the problem is only knowing the ratings of their TOP 3 that Sat/Sun.
The third episode of Bleach was the first to go to top 3 at 479,000.

Let's look at Death Note's list of ratings

Oct. 20 Death Note: 499,000 (Top 3) - fantastic
Oct. 27 below Blood+: 303,000 - average week (DN doing bad)
Nov. 3 below Futurama: 407,000
Nov. 10 Death Note: 400,000 (Top 3) - good
Nov. 24 below Boondocks[3AM]: 299,000 - bad week (DN even worse)

Fall ratings are similar to winter ratings(with the exception of december break)
Here is some Bleach from 2007 winter

Jan 6. Bleach: 408,000 (Top 1)
Jan 13. below Futurama: 367,000
Jan 20. Bleach: 345,000 (Top 3)
Feb 3. Bleach: 299,000 (Top 3) - bad week (doing average)
Feb 10. below Trinity Blood: 312,000
Feb 17. Bleach: 410,000 (Top 1)
Feb 24. Bleach: 317,000 (Top 1) - bad week (Bleach doing good)

Here is the most recent Fall Bleach

Oct. 6 Bleach: 494,000 (Top 2) - pretty good
Oct. 13 Bleach: 386,000 (Top 3) - average

Bleach does well on its performance by going to TOP 3 quite often, several times it has actually spiked above 500,000.

This begining of Death Note hasn't consistently scored as pleasing as we'd all hope, and it isn't a series one can jump into after several episodes, especially when it becomes dull in the 2nd half. Its average ratings of course will only get worse.

If Code Geass gets its own promo 5 weeks late, potentially the same could happen. The Light = Lelouch character could also play in unfavorable. If someone doesn't like one of the maniacs, they wont stick around to see the other.

[EndlessSky]

Bosch, for Lelouch huh..... he is a good voice actor but I don't his tone of voice fits for Lelouch. He needs a more deeper calm and collected voice.

I liked his dubb work on Vash from Trigun and Renton from Eureka 7 but Ichigo and Lelouch just doesn't seem right.

[Kuroudo]

Lol hes blue morpheus

[Samanosuke]

Kenshin rapestomps

[Sushi]

I think I would support Kira if he killed major criminals and murderers, but if he started killing petty criminals and FBI agents like he does in later manga volumes I would want him to be stopped. Once he begins to kill those who arnt even proven criminals and those who never did anything wrong (such as the FBI agents) it would be safe to assume his sense of "justice" has gone awry and he has become a murderer himself. After that I would stop supporting him and begin supporting L.

[Sushi]

Light has gone crazy. He becomes so obbesessed with power and a need to kill L that he can't help but be angry and frustrated all the time. Not only that, but he is under a constant amount of stress with the entire world after him, wanting nothing but to bring him down. I think I would be a little hot-headed too if I were Light.

He is extremely careful of how he displays his emotions on the outside though. He kees a level head and even keeps his grades up. He knows how to function well under stress and does it beautifully. L is just able to see through it better than Light can mask it.

[Twister1352]

Uh, no, only his Super Special Awesome powers have to do with Ichigo, his physical strength shouldn't be affected by it (except it will be increased when he uses Puberty Power).
Otherwise, Chad can survive anything that hits him. And by that I mean including a motorbike accident, a steel beam falling on his head, etc.
And Chad can fight too, he's got the killer punches.


Lol think about what you are saying, you know how big that beam was? In real life that would kill a man or break his back, even if he was as big as chad.

It's obvious that he had super strength back then... I mean COME ON a huge metal beam?

[Undying]

Lol think about what you are saying, you know how big that beam was? In real life that would kill a man or break his back, even if he was as big as chad.
It's obvious that he had super strength back then... I mean COME ON a huge metal beam?
First of all do you realize how big CHAD is compared to that beam? It looked like a toothpick compared to him!

Second, Chad is huge and it's not fat. So yeah, he CAN survive that steel beam without Puberty Power.

It's anime.

[FullMetal Rebel]

Actually, Chad didn't get super strong until he began hanging around Ichigo, right? I mean, the whole reason anyone around Ichigo has powers is because of his spirit energy haveing an effect on the physical world. That's the reason captain's need limiters, because their sheer reiatsu could alter the physical plane.
Back when Chad was getting picked on for being a foreigner he wasn't super strong, just "big guy" strong. Martial artist strength trumps regular big-guy strength. Just ask Bruce Lee.


It wouldn't matter. Bruce Lee is pretty built, is Ichigo?No. He looks like a weasel in his human form. I don't care how good you are at martial arts if your that damn skinny, you won't beat a strong jacked up guy. This is why certain sports have weight classes>.<

[zan_get_su]

Here is another Death Note Dub Episode...Enjoy

Death Note - 8 - Glare {C_P}

http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img151/3981/vlcsnap44055oz2.png

MU Link

http://www.megaupload.com/?f=FS9PPEQV

[silverwolf801]

well man you might not be active here but I have to rep you for always giving us links to the show.

[Samanosuke]

It wouldn't matter. Bruce Lee is pretty built, is Ichigo?No. He looks like a weasel in his human form. I don't care how good you are at martial arts if your that damn skinny, you won't beat a strong jacked up guy. This is why certain sports have weight classes>.<

Thread over.

[Samanosuke]

I said ichigo because ogichi is ichigo.
Ogichi is not more powerful then ichigo, most people don't get that ichigo does not have full control over his body, can not release his full power, or fight at his full speed, ogichi can use all the traits to the max, mainly because he works from the inside and can unlock full "access" to them, where in if ichigo used them, it would exhaust and break his body down.
Example, first time ogichi makes a appearance, ichigos bones clearly snapped under the pressure of moving as fast as he can.
But yeah..


Exactly. Not only that, the will to kill/fight is apparently much bigger in Ogichi's case.

For example:

Imagine 2 normal humans are fighting against each other. Both have a knife, the exact same physical attributes (strength, speed, stamina, physique etc.) but they differ in terms of personality.

Person A is a twisted and bloodlusted individual who doesn't hesitate in the slightest to kill his opponent and is not afraid of the legal and psychological consequences.

Person B is someone who hesitates to do someone harm, thinks a lot of legal and psychological consequences of his actions.

Who wins?

[CallouS]

I totally agree!

:D

[Barbaroi]

Yea, I have to say Kenshin. Although I haven't seen the full series of either one, but I have seen probably half of Samurai Champloo and most of Ruroni and from what I seen, Kenshin is a bada$$. I think I seen them both on [AS] lol.

[CallouS]

It would be really, really sweet if they made an episode where Jin and Kenshin verse.

[Mugen]

This is an unfair match up to be honest. Kenshin has a whole damn arsenal of abilities he could use against Jin but Jin doesn't have much except mastering one Sword Style...If it was an even match without any special abilities then I'd Have to say Jin...

[DarkSlayer]

Kenshin would win. He has the almost unstoppable Kuzu Ryusozen and even has a counter to the unstoppable move Amakak...whatever you get it.
Jin has form, but without moves he's ******.

The "Amakakiru Ryo No Hirameki" is what you're refering to I believe.

And yes, Himura would win. I don't know much about this "Jin" guy, but I've seen Himura at his finest, and I personally feel sorry for any of his opponents. Especially if they piss him off. (Ex: Kanryu Takeda)

[CallouS]

Well, if it was Hitokiri Battousai versus Jin it would be a one-move fight. Battoujutsu is undoubtedly one of the best styles.

[Neko Bam]

Nappa vs Ikkaku:
Ikkaku: BAN....KAI!
Nappa: Hey Vegeta, what does the scouter say about his power level?
Vegeta: IT'S OVER NINE THOUSAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND

:)hehe, seriously though, I think bankai Ikkaku would win, but by a hearlength.

[DarkSlayer]

Ikkaku ftw.

I'm sorry, but after all of the videos on youtube and all of the times that Nappa has been made fun of for the "IT'S OVER 9000!" "WHAT?! 9000?!" I'm sick of seeing his ugly face.

EDIT: Yeah, and right after I posted this, I look up, and what do I see? That same quote. I so called it.

[Killa Cam]

Everyone in this thread save for Noitora is a complete jackass, no question. Its one thing to be retarded enough to think Nappa still has anything on Tien after Freeza and beyond, but for Ikkaku to even tickle anyone from DBZ is fail. Shame on you all.

[DarkSlayer]

Everyone in this thread save for Noitora is a complete jackass, no question. Its one thing to be retarded enough to think Nappa still has anything on Tien after Freeza and beyond, but for Ikkaku to even tickle anyone from DBZ is fail. Shame on you all.

Rofl. :face82:

[Samanosuke]

Ikkaku at bankai beating either Tien or Nappa? Not happening, I'm sorry fanboys.

Piccolo Junior, someone who busted an entire city in the 23rd Budokai (original DB) was killed by Nappa.

Here is Nappa busting an entire city with ease:

http://img.bleachexile.com/manga/dragon-ball/Db18ch09/DBZ%20119.jpg
http://img.bleachexile.com/manga/dragon-ball/Db18ch09/DBZ%20120.jpg


Since the OP stated nothing specifically, we will base everyone on his strongest form, that means we also base Tien's strength in the Buu Saga.

Tien is much stronger than Nappa in the Buu Saga

Here is Tien blocking an attack from Buu fused with SSJ3 Gotenks:

http://img.bleachexile.com/manga/dragon-ball/Db41ch16/411609.gif
http://img.bleachexile.com/manga/dragon-ball/Db41ch16/411610.gif

Tien surviving a direct attack from Majin Buu + SSJ3 Gotenks afterwards is also proof for his durability.



Tien solos this shitty matchup.

[CallouS]

Well, think also of how much Tien has improved through-out the series. Had Nappa been around as long as Tien, he would wipe the floor with him.


Ikkaku wouldn't stand a chance. Plus, think of what would happen if Nappa entered his Oozoru form. That'd be DOMINATION.

[Seff vi Britannia]

Erm, seeing as mr "Enel is lightning" is using logic like that, i'll use mine.

You're implying Luffy moves faster than light (lightning moves at the speed of light, or thereabouts. Let's call it that for the purpose of this thread.) Obviously, this is total crap, as we can see from the current arc, Luffy moves nowhere near the speed of light.

Ichigo, on the other hand, is able to produce multiple images of himself. To do so implies you move faster than the speed of light (if you're somewhere else but a person can see you in your previous location still, you're moving faster than light.)

[Killa Cam]

Even if Nappa lasted as long as Tien, I don't think he'd have room for improvement..we all know that Nappa is stupid and as a human, we've seen Tien jump high levels like when fighting Cell and Buu. The way I see it is:

-Tien: Smart and Experienced.
-Ikkaku: Battle hungry and reckless
-Nappa: An idiot.

[Samanosuke]

Well I'll just throw in my 2 cents in dis one.

Saying that Ichigo moves at the speed of sound, let alone the speed of light just because of creating multiple afterimages is a logical fallacy.

7)Non-Sequiter: This is when someone's conclusion is not implied at all by the premise.

Example:

"Ichigo is faster than sound because he leaves 6 afterimages"

The person in this example starts with a true premise (Ichigo leaves afterimages), but then jumps to a conclusion which is in no way implied by that premise (Ichigo is FTS).


If I remember correctly, Kid Goku created after images in one of his very first tournaments while running around his opponent.

DBZ fighters even moved so fast that they weren't even visible anymore. Being invisible because of speed > creating afterimages.

So why do I think creating after images is not the speed of light.

Well looking at the end of DBZ, SSJ Gotenks showed the most outstanding speed feat in DBZ:

Goku is hinted to be a LITTLE slower than Gotenks, who took several seconds to fly around the world eight times.

The earth has a equator admeasurement of 40.075 Kilometer.

That 8 times make: 320600 kilometers in lets say 3 seconds.


That's 320600000 meters in 3 seconds

Speed of Light:299 792 458 m/s

1079252848,8 km/h

Goku Speed: 106866666 m/s

=384719997,6 km/h

[Kuroudo]

lol, we were not being jackasses, we were being silly. Its a fact, Ikkaku has the shiniest bald head ever, i mean in a Shinigami Golden Cup his head was mistaken for the moon. This is not really a serious anime thread, more comedy than real. Yes DBZ characters <<< Bleach Characters minus Aizen. Most Likely Tien would win, how godmoded the numerous amount of DBZ characters is beyond allot. Chi's not even Japanese... we have no idea what Ikkaku's Bankai does anyways, its just really powerful in strength of an attack, like Zaraki.

IMO:

Ikkaku's Character design and personality >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>TIen and Nappas.

Bleach [In general] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DB, DBZ, DBGT.etc

[Kuroudo]

I thought Ichigo won this battle already.....wait Zanga, you Fool! youve re-opened it!! do i need to call James Cizuz over?

[Samanosuke]

lol DBZ beats Bleach in power, character development, storyline, originality, and character design.

Here's an interesting post from Camron summarizing the Soul Society Arc and the HM-Arc while automatically proving the repetitive nature of Bleach:

i could write u a summary that would both cover SS arc and HM arc right now.

____ gets kidnapped Ichigo and his friends train to get more powerful with urahara. _____ acts emotional in her cell while Ichigo and co invades _______ to save her. All the while the ______ of ______ stumble to stop the intruders(Ichigo and co) to their world called _______. During Ichigo's adventure in ________ he meets ______ and he receives his first power-up. He then meets _______ a friendly ______ that helps him in his adventure. After awhile they discover ________ isn't entirely evil and that their only doing it for their sense of purpse. Ichigo then fights ________ the main antagonist and rescues _________.


Sorry for bein off topic but this really had to be stated lawl.

[Killa Cam]

lol, we were not being jackasses, we were being silly. Its a fact, Ikkaku has the shiniest bald head ever, i mean in a Shinigami Golden Cup his head was mistaken for the moon. This is not really a serious anime thread, more comedy than real. Yes DBZ characters <<< Bleach Characters minus Aizen. Most Likely Tien would win, how godmoded the numerous amount of DBZ characters is beyond allot. Chi's not even Japanese... we have no idea what Ikkaku's Bankai does anyways, its just really powerful in strength of an attack, like Zaraki.

IMO:

Ikkaku's Character design and personality >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>TIen and Nappas.

Bleach [In general] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DB, DBZ, DBGT.etcThanks for the luls XD LOL!!!

[Seff vi Britannia]

I don't really care for your copied/pasted logical fallacy stuff tbh, the point i was making is that there's no way Luffy moves at the speed of light, and/or is faster than Ichigo. And DBZ can't be used to compare anything to anything.

[James Cizuz]

Well I'll just throw in my 2 cents in dis one.

Saying that Ichigo moves at the speed of sound, let alone the speed of light just because of creating multiple afterimages is a logical fallacy.

7)Non-Sequiter: This is when someone's conclusion is not implied at all by the premise.

Example:

"Ichigo is faster than sound because he leaves 6 afterimages"

The person in this example starts with a true premise (Ichigo leaves afterimages), but then jumps to a conclusion which is in no way implied by that premise (Ichigo is FTS).


If I remember correctly, Kid Goku created after images in one of his very first tournaments while running around his opponent.

DBZ fighters even moved so fast that they weren't even visible anymore. Being invisible because of speed > creating afterimages.

So why do I think creating after images is not the speed of light.

Well looking at the end of DBZ, SSJ Gotenks showed the most outstanding speed feat in DBZ:

Goku is hinted to be a LITTLE slower than Gotenks, who took several seconds to fly around the world eight times.

The earth has a equator admeasurement of 40.075 Kilometer.

That 8 times make: 320600 kilometers in lets say 3 seconds.


That's 320600000 meters in 3 seconds

Speed of Light:299 792 458 m/s

1079252848,8 km/h

Goku Speed: 106866666 m/s

=384719997,6 km/h

Comparing shows like DBZ, where in most cases TOLD you outright the power levels, speed etc of characters is ridicules when comparing to bleach. Other then that, you are implying goku is not faster then light. Though I agree, when he is not using instant teleportation, however using it he is just as fast or more.

Lots of other logical misinterpretations, horrible translations, and blatant "screw you" by the person who made DBZ has always bugged me. Bluma liked to state numbers, such as "blah blah even at light speed it would be 41,000 years to get to namik!" Though when goku shows he is fast as light, when using instant teleportation, takes mere moments to jump solar system to galaxy wide. This was before cell fights etc. So saying gotenks is faster then goku when comparing his speed of going around the planet is.... Hard. Depending on what situation, and if goku would use instant teleportation or not, or if gotenks can use it ETC.

An afterimage implies a misconception to most people. Most people think an afterimage implies that the person is moving so fast, light is in fact leaving trace rendering, and or copies of an object not there, being bounced back as he moves. An after image means, that an object is moving so fast, your eye can not track it anymore. Meaning, your brane, which receives the same as 120 frames per second, is still registering the that you are there. Though afterimages only appear for mere moments, sometimes to the degree you will see double vision.

The top tier people in this world, meaning above average with tracking can track up to 3500 feet per second. Sound travels at 1,100 feet per second. So at the least, we can measure that ichigo goes faster then 3500 feet per second, noting that captains would have at least the ability to track that much, as they have been trained in it all there life. Normal humans track up to 2500 btw. Meaning, if we were to LOOSELY take it at face value, just a guess, we could say, LOOSELY how fast ichigo might be moving, by number of after images. Though since we do not know for sure what after image implys in bleach we can only speculate, same with one piece however. In one piece, enel is clearing lightning, but does not move at that speed. Given the benefit of any doubt, anyone could agree ichigo was faster then sound, how much faster? Well, taken into account of after images, strain on body, coupled with shunpu descriptions, I would say hypersonic speeds. That of 5000 feet per second. Regardless, using the same logic towards luffy, he is not much faster then a normal human, unless he uses the elasticity to repel or pull him forward.

As for kid goku creating after images, if I remember correctly it hints at sound speeds in dragon ball, around the end. I know at the beginning of DBZ they clearly moved faster then sound. Taking for example, radditz catching a bullet, with no problem. That requires much more then just speed however.

Also, to be invisible because of speed would require an object to move fast enough, that not ENOUGH light hitting it is being rebounded to the eye of another person. Some is, and you will see a sort of "blur" or even an "after image" but what you describe, for the size of a human, would require speeds around hypersonic.

Other then that, I hope people don't think I hate luffy. He is one of my favorite characters, I just defend when someone states something that is obvious to a normal un-bias person, and states the opposite.

[James Cizuz]

Does this mean normal nappa? Because nappa during the hell saga, would own kriller, tien, and ikkaku.

[BrolyLOL]

This is a bit annoying, when people talk about Light all the L fans say is "I LIKE L BETTER BECAUSE HE ISNT CRAZY AND LIGHT LOST WHAT NOW *****!" and I literally facepalm. What can drive so many people to like an emo diabetic? This is probably the one guy in mainstream anime who is overrated more than Byakuya.

Can anyone name me three good reasons to like L that doesn't involve sweets, justice, and outward appearances?

...

[BrolyLOL]

Yeah, for the most part this thread has nothing to do with Light, and just a hypothetical Kira. We would have no idea if he wants to be God or not or is as insanely self-righteous. :/
Please, he's just like Aizen. The Justice crap was only a cover...even if his intentions were to rid the world of evil back then, that still implies him ruling over the world. He was trying to take over the world from the start...and there's nothing wrong with supporting that 'cause if you call me crazy for what I just said (presumably an L fangirl), then you need to step away from the computer.

And as they say, "It's a work of fiction, chill!"

[BrolyLOL]

Rid the world of one more emo. Good for the rest of us.

[BrolyLOL]

Of course. People afraid of using the death note are some mark-ass....never mind.

[Sushi]

L is an extremely intelligent character who can solve difficult cases without breaking a sweat. I personally like him because he is the most complex and interesting character in the anime. I enjoy seeing how he can look through the clues given to him and come up with a solution.

And I don't think that he's overrated at all, he deserves his popularity-just look at all that he did to bring Light down. But, my opinion is biased. I like L alot, just like I like Byakuya. So this is merely a byakuya and L fangirl statement lol

[Lust]

i like light more than L
What can drive so many people to like an emo diabetic?
and i lulz at this....beats me i dont get it either probably most ppl liekcandy,and they leik candy bo? XD

[Lust]

well this prove light is better than L

[BrolyLOL]

L is an extremely intelligent character who can solve difficult cases without breaking a sweat. I personally like him because he is the most complex and interesting character in the anime. I enjoy seeing how he can look through the clues given to him and come up with a solution.
And I don't think that he's overrated at all, he deserves his popularity-just look at all that he did to bring Light down. But, my opinion is biased. I like L alot, just like I like Byakuya. So this is merely a byakuya and L fangirl statement lol

Wrong. Considering he was in the manga for twice as many chapters, Light is obviously the most complex character (sounds like a blanket statement but it's actually true if you consider how he changed after L's death). Interesting is more subjective though, but even still Light takes it alone because he's fukan Kira.

And...Byakuya and L fangirls, oh why do so many of these exist? That's like being devoted to 2x the fail.

[Lust]

the reason why its quite obvius,they fan liek how they act and how they behave,etc...simple as that:cm:

[Taguro]

This anime is just wonderful. If you like harry potter and anime your in luck. This anime has it all. Extreme battles, Drama, Good story, and a smart protagonist(which is a real plus.you'd know what i mean if you watch Naruto).

[Lust]

yesh this anime is nice but liek harry potter? hmm no comment :D
Extreme battles, Drama, Good story, and a smart protagonist(which is a real plus.you'd know what i mean if you watch Naruto).
the story is funny,and the battle juz prove how a normal human can take down magic with his bare hand...but it switch to Mo enventually ....

[FullMetal Rebel]

All the characters from Naruto v.s. the characters from Dragonball(not DBZ).

[Decado]

I haven't seen every last episode of DB, but with characters like Kid Goku and Piccolo (they seem to be the only ones with excessive moving and power?) against the horde of Akatsuki (this alone I think would be enough) along with the Sennin, current Sasuke's Snake team, all of Naruto's team and the rest of Konoha, I don't see DB fighter's keeping their own much too long.

A good suggestive battle tho. I might need to 'research' some more DB characters but I'm pretty sure it would be Narutoverse's victory

[Taguro]

Whoa,whoa,whoa.......s it even a contest. Sure the naruto characters have some good defenses and strategies, but are we forgeting who these DBZ people are. They would blast them to pieces. They where blowing up planets. Matter of fact, Get majinn Buu over here to turn them into choclate. Thats enough, i think.

[B-Eazy]

dont bring this thread back from the dead besides we got past that its now Greed vs Ichigo. but james cizuz as already summed it up with ichigo winning
Anyone can bump this thread if they want, its not closed. Also its not A Greed vs Ichi thread so at least be relevant if your gonna psuedomod.

ANYWAYS, Rock Lee outclasses him by far in all around fighting ability. I say that because Ed can almost keep up with Envy but wouldn't give Rock Lee the least bit of comp. So Rock Lee could destroy him in a fight. When you bring regeneration and nearly unlimited stamina it doesn't matter how many gates Lee opens cuz he won't be able to destroy a homunculous

[Decado]

who these DBZ people are
DBZ are greater than all. Goku himself will destroy many "pwn" characters by lifting his finger.

However:
characters from Dragonball(not DBZ).
NOT DBZ. That was the second season. He means only Dragon Ball, when Goku was still a child.

There's already a rule against DBZ related threads :)

[Kenken]

DBZ characters: they can destroy a planet, or more than one with a single attack

Naruto characters: they can't

=/

[Decado]

er... I'll repeat again. This isn't for DBZ characters. Just Dragon Ball characters

There are 3 series

- Dragon Ball (Goku is a little kid with hardly 1% of his adult power

- DBZ (uber hax)

- DBGT (uber crap show with uber uber hax powah)



We're concerned with the first one.

[Kenken]

oh o.O

the manga has the same name >_>

mmm

in that case i would say Naruto wins, DB arean't so strong >.>

[Gettles]

NOT DBZ. That was the second season. He means only Dragon Ball, when Goku was still a child.
There's already a rule against DBZ related threads :)

Even then, I believe that Roshi was able to destroy the moon in regular DB. This still goes way beyond curbstomp.

[Decado]

Yes, but would Roshi be able to stand up to the combined might of the Akatsuki? (There's plenty more powerful Naruto characters to stand up to the rest of DB)

For example. Just Hidan himself against Roshi.
During battle Hidan can get Roshi's blood where, upon consuming it, he draws a symbol on the ground that "links" him. Once this link is created Hidan is essentially a voodoo doll for Roshi; any damage that is done to Hidan is also done to Roshi
And that's just one defensive ability.

Also, the time it would take Roshi to power up a kamehameha, someone like Itachi can mind freak him.

[SupraSpeed]

id say naruto characters would win, you gotta remeber, it only takes a split second to get caught up in a genjutsu.... dragonball is really just brute strength. As much as i love dragonball, id have to say they would lose

[Kenken]

DB maybe brute strength, but it's pointless because they lack speed, unlike DBZ and DBGT

[Lust]

DB maybe brute strength, but it's pointless because they lack speed, unlike DBZ and DBGT
and naruto character has the speed advantage,skills...etc

[Kenken]

exactly, Naruto ppl can overpower the DB ppl quite easily

[Lust]

and if itachi/sasuke or any those char that have sharigan fight with them,they totally ass rape db character

[Kenken]

they could copy their techniques, and use them against them

after all, most characters are human and they got the power level of an average human.

[Lust]

i think you forgot that those eyes can predict movement too ken =)

[Kenken]

Then Uchina and Sasuke alone will be able to take most of the DB characters out, if not all

[B-Eazy]

Narutoverse hands down. Roshi is the only real comp in Dragonball and theres no way he could take Itachi, Tsunade or Kakashi nevermind them all at the same time

[Tobi]

Tobi alone would anniahlate Dragonball-verse. Same goes for Pein.

[Silhouette]

Yeah, no. After a debate is 'finished', and everyone has moved on, the thread can be considered 'closed'. Naturally, since mods have forsaken this section, the threads will be technically open however.

Bumping old and over-debated threads is seen as very annoying in the eyes of the debaters here. Just a heads up. And what he did was not pseudo-modding.

Bumping a thread to add NEW info that hasn't been posted before, which could change the circumstances - or even outcome - of the fight is different however. Bumping it just to post what's already been posted... is just annoying. -_-


PS. This is pseudo-modding.

"After four pages of people saying that 'Envy wins do to regeneration and infinate stamina', there is no longer ANY need to post in this thread. So everyone STFU and stop posting in it for fucks sake.

/closes thread."

But seriously, the winner is obvious now people.

[edit]

One more thing.

Also its not A Greed vs Ichi thread so at least be relevant if your gonna psuedomod.

If you actually read the above posts, you'd see that they indeed did change it to Greed vs Ichigo. kthxbai.

[Lust]

Narutoverse hands down. Roshi is the only real comp in Dragonball and theres no way he could take Itachi, Tsunade or Kakashi nevermind them all at the same time
actually picollo is the strongest one in db..but heck with ninja imba haxxor skill....i dont think it make any differences

[Silhouette]

Wow. Yeah, um. DB characters aren't as slow as people make them out to be. Goku was making afterimages since childhood.

And Sharingan doesn't copy moves. It copies the HANDSIGNS used for moves, thus allowing the user to make said handsigns and use the move.

No DB move uses handsigns, thus something like Kamehameha can't be copied. And even if it could, the DB characters have much more energy to use.

You guys are seriously underestimating DB. I wasn't really a fan of that particular part of the series, but still.. Piccolo can regenerate also, which people seem to forget - not to mention change his size and multiply.

The only reason the DB characters are losing is the number advantage Naruto-verse has. Its pretty much like 5 people (that matter) vs the 100s of Naruto-verse characters there are.

Maybe if it was limited to certain characters... >: /

[Lust]

even so,a mangekyou sharingan can k.o all of the Db character

[Silhouette]

And while Itachi/Kakashi is dealing with one character, another 1-hit kills him from behind. :whatevah:

But yeah, number advantage.

[Lust]

you forgot that sharingan can see through movement or "predict" movement :/
and its not bout the number but power :/

[Silhouette]

Yeah, um. DB characters move much faster than the eye. They were doing the "disappear-reappear" movement thing since the early tournaments.

Listen, Sharingan won't win the entire fight. My vote is for the Naruto-verse, because of their numbers. If you're going to try and make me say that "Sharingan > DB", then you're wasting your time. :whatevah:

[edit]

Note: I like Naruto far more than DB (I kinda found DB boring, compared to DBZ). So this isn't fanboyism on my part. Just throwing that out there, before someone tries to throw that on me. >.>

[Lust]

naruto also does "disappear-reappear" movement thing too :<
sharingan hynoptise skill screw Db char,they fight while watching their opponent...normal habit fer martial artist...

[Decado]

Note: I like Naruto far more than DB (I kinda found DB boring, compared to DBZ). So this isn't fanboyism on my part. Just throwing that out there, before someone tries to throw that on me. >.>
If they do it's a weak argument. If anyone ever tries to present that it means you auto-win whatever you're debating. We will all know this.. anytime the person is targetted instead of the topic, it means the other person has lost. Shamefully.

My vote is for the Naruto-verse, because of their numbers.
That's my main focus. Just too many.

But I think even the whole group of Akatsuki would be enough for all of DB. Then imagine the horde of other Narutoverse characters... it's just endless.

naruto also does "disappear-reappear" movement thing too :<
That's a skill in naruto, not just raw speed. DB > all for speed related issues.

[Silhouette]

@Kay: DB characters also leave afterimages. While that doesn't necessarily count as speed-determination, it can be quite confusing.

Sharingan.. Yeah, except when they fly into the air and blast away with energy shots from heights their opponents can't reach (or have eye contact with them).

Kakashi was able to withstand Tsukuyomi (sp?). People like Goku, Roshi, and Piccolo would hardly be phased by it. Then there's Tien and Yamcha, who were actually powerful in DB (before they were shrouded in the pwn that is SSJ).

<.<

We can stop this anytime you want, you know? You're kinda making me want to change my vote here. All of the DB characters take flight to a point that can't be reached by Naruto characters... then just bomb the **** out of them like.. nvm. I won't use that joke. -_-

@Dec: Yeh. Those damn numbers.

If they do it's a weak argument. If anyone ever tries to present that it means you auto-win whatever you're debating. We will all know this.. anytime the person is targetted instead of the topic, it means the other person has lost. Shamefully.

Depends. Sometimes its obvious if someone's 'debating' on with nothing behind them but 'fanboyism'. IE, someone debating to the death that Hanawatshisface could beat SSJ4 Gogeta. >.>

[VIDTID]

That isnt much of a competition is it lol. I mean dbz characters can blow up the world so therefore theyd win straight away hands down! Unless kakashi and sasuke use their sharingon to copy the kamehameha wave and kill goku :P

[Lust]

^ it only db characters involve in this battle not dbz characters >_>

[Samanosuke]

Interesting matchup.

First of all: The OP doesn't state anything specifically so we'll base everyone on their strongest forms (i.e. 23rd Budokai in DB and current Naruto stats).

In addition we can not simply assume that Chakra=Ki, making Genjutsu in any form useless.

Genjutsu connects the cranial nerves with chakra, so what's left is Ninjutsu and Taijutsu.

Taking into account that DB already has citybusters towards the end (i refer to Piccolo Junior in the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai), Mutenroshi who was able to bust the moon with a Kamehameha, nearly everyone having the speed edge against naruto characters to a point where a mere second seems like an eternity (reffering to the Krillin vs Muten Roshi fight in Goku's very first Budokai).

The only edge the Narutoverse has in dis one is practically the sheer amount of useful fighters like Decado already pointed out.

A tough decision, but my vote goes barely to the Narutoverse just becuz of dat quantity edge.

[Mugen]

I would have to say...Jack because even though I am an Avid Champloo fan Jack has fought alot more foes than Mugen has and they're Robots at that. Mugen has fought some powerful foes indeed and his erratic fighting style will come as a shock to Jack but like Vlaew the failiure said Mugen has only fought about 5 people worth his time.

[CallouS]

Oh yeah. Who do you think would reign supreme in a bout between an Eva and Gundam?

[_Ink]

Ugh, you should be shot for comparing this to that.

You realize the sheer difference in size?
A Gundam's beam spam wouldn't scratch shit off the Field.

An eva's foot (just up till the ankle) is the size of a 10 storey building.
One gundam is the size of a 10 storey building.

Heck, even Jesus Yamato would take ages of scratching with his tiny lazors to scratch through the Absolute Terror Field.

Plus, the Terror Field is regeneratable, it is created by the mental ability. Take someone like Asuka who can control her abilities (before going MOOTHEEERRR I AM A F*CKING PSYCHO!!!), she can probably wait for the Gundam whoever is driving it to get tired

(even Coordinators get tired from piloting the thing too long)

and catch them and crush them like a bug.

Plus, any eva weapon is generally the size of one gundam, go near those and you risk dying, if you rush onto an eva in a standard sized gundam, you probably get electrocuted or crushed between two palms of Field energy straightaway.


But I am not bias.

I think:

God Gundam / Devil Gundam
Dendrobium (full armor + Limitless energy)
White Base + Jesus Yamato and Strike Freedom

could probably bring one Eva down...
That is if the bottom two don't die first.

God Gundam is hax anyway, so yeah, no arguments there.

[CallouS]

Ugh!

I forgot about the absolute terror field!


Crrrap. D:

[CallouS]

In almost every situation a Saiyan has a Naruto-ninja beaten. Speed, beaten. Power, beaten. Stamina, beaten.

The main thing to remember is that Saiyan's are a purely fighter race, born to kill. They have the innate ability to end lives, where as Naruto-ninja have to learn such a skill.

[Kuroudo]

In almost every situation a Saiyan has a Naruto-ninja beaten. Speed, beaten. Power, beaten. Stamina, beaten.
The main thing to remember is that Saiyan's are a purely fighter race, born to kill. They have the innate ability to end lives, where as Naruto-ninja have to learn such a skill.

There are only two saiyans at the time, Goku and hes still a kid. He can leave afterimages yes which would out speed any other character. I believe that Roshi vs Hidan, Hidan wins that defensive ability in which they share the exact same wounds.

I also agree that DBZ+ Was uber hax and was a crappy Anime, at least the later parts of DBZ and the entire GT. They just became wayyy to powerful, like dark schnider, who i may say can defeat Goku.

Back on topic, Naruto-verse wins this one, They got the Demons too including 9-tailed fox (which will only happen if naruto dies i think) Itachi will mangekyou Sharigan the crap out of several DB characters, which are probably led at this point by Piccolo, Roshi and Goku. Goku > Piccolo just barely because Goku defeated Piccolo by raming into him when they were both crippled. Gokus Kamehameha is stronger than Rasengan but i dont think its stronger than 4-tailed Rasengan, + the fact that they have Gaara on their side who i think is impossible to kill with just Physical attacks.

have you ever noticed that DBZ is all about power....not special abilties or unique abilities just plain old fighting with some Special powers put in (such has Kamehameha and Special Beam Cannon) No real strategy put in.

[Samanosuke]

There are only two saiyans at the time, Goku and hes still a kid. He can leave afterimages yes which would out speed any other character. I believe that Roshi vs Hidan, Hidan wins that defensive ability in which they share the exact same wounds.

As stated above, we always base the powerlevel of the strongest form in the series, as long as the OP doesn't state anythin specifically. Goku ain't a dkid at the end of DB anymore.


Back on topic, Naruto-verse wins this one, They got the Demons too including 9-tailed fox (which will only happen if naruto dies i think) Itachi will mangekyou Sharigan the crap out of several DB characters,

lol. Plz show me a scan where they state dat the Kyuubi becomes a seperate entity again as soon as Naruto dies.

Mangekyou Sharingan won't work on any DB characters. It's still a Genjutsu and Genjutsu connects the cranial nerves via chakra. DB characters have no chakra so dis point is null.

Roshi and Goku. Goku > Piccolo just barely because Goku defeated Piccolo by raming into him when they were both crippled. Gokus Kamehameha is stronger than Rasengan but i dont think its stronger than 4-tailed Rasengan

lawl

+ the fact that they have Gaara on their side who i think is impossible to kill with just Physical attacks.

lol @ dis part. Let's not forget that he was almost beaten by someone who only uses physical attacks. Every main character in DB can use Ki for ranged moves, good bye Gaara.

have you ever noticed that DBZ is all about power....not special abilties or unique abilities just plain old fighting with some Special powers put in (such has Kamehameha and Special Beam Cannon) No real strategy put in.

Have you ever noticed that your beloved Bleach rips of the same series your rantin bout, + Yu Yu Hakusho?

Anyway, Narutoverse still wins cuz of the reason stated in my previous post.

[Ryuzaki]

I thought this would be interesting since two Immortals would be fighting. One Immortal can transform, and the other can touch anything he chooses and has a release form.

I think that Tyki will own Envy, even though he's Immortal too, since Tyki can pretty much take out all of his internal organs anytime he wants, and he won't get hit by Envy since he can just go through him when in hand-to-hand combat.

And even if Envy does somehow damage Tyki, he will just regenerate himself like it was nothing.

[Kuroudo]

Have you ever noticed that your beloved Bleach rips of the same series your rantin bout, + Yu Yu Hakusho?

Anyway, Narutoverse still wins cuz of the reason stated in my previous post.

Uh i never ranted about Bleach being original, its not everythings been probably done before

Ichigo = Spiky hair and Big Sword = Cloud Strife
Kakashi= Based on Rikimaru

Gaara was defeated because he used up most of his Chakra saving the village from being bombed.

Mangekyou Sharingan won't work on any DB characters. It's still a Genjutsu and Genjutsu connects the cranial nerves via chakra. DB characters have no chakra so dis point is null.

Sucks for Itachi then, hes pretty much screwed if he cant use Mangekyou in a battle aganist a non-chakra related character.

Naruto-verse wins either way.

[Kuroudo]

Psuedo Modding time,

2 pages of 95% of the people saying that Jack would win, and due to: better expirence, better combat skill and this adds on to expirence, hes fought the supernatural EX: a giant shape shifting demon and an army of reinforce steel armored robots.

Jack won. This should be /closed.

[Sushi]

Originally Posted by BrolyLOL
And...Byakuya and L fangirls, oh why do so many of these exist? That's like being devoted to 2x the fail.
because byakuya and L are just amazing.

[SupraSpeed]

all deidra has to do is make those microscopic bombs and all of the db characters would explode from the inside out!!!

The reason i say narutoverse would win is because of sheer numbers and much more techniques. db is awsome, don't get me wrong, but naruto characters have way more tricks up their sleeves.

[lordstrix]

chad dosnt like fighting...but im sry to say ichigo, but chad would maul u if he wanted to ... unless does ichigo fights dirty ...like w/ a semi

[DarkSlayer]

chad dosnt like fighting...but im sry to say ichigo, but chad would maul u if he wanted to ... unless does ichigo fights dirty ...like w/ a semi

Ichigo is too much of a good-goody to pull a gun on someone.

[BrolyLOL]

because byakuya and L are just amazing at failing.

I completed your thought for you, and no they both suck, but at least L gave Light a challenge, can you imagine Jewchiki trying to roll with Aizen? FUKAN LOL

[Lust]

>_>
lol,a thread bout L turn into L and byakuya

[BrolyLOL]

You cant have one overrated bishounen without the other (no homo).

[Icestorm]

This is just basically a character bashing thread and has the potential to turn into a flaming.

I warn thee to be careful.

[EndlessSky]

I actually like Mello and Makami over L, Near, and maybe even Light.

No character is better than the other come on. It's all about whose personallity you like or dislike etc.

[BrolyLOL]

which is not a problem until L fans OD with their bad logic.

[Slayus]

Yeah... as "evil" as it is.... I'd use it... not to become a god.... more of a way to payback enemies.

[Slayus]

I would support Kira... Tell you the truth... I was rooting for Kira the whole series, and like someone posted before... the series wanted you to.

Although there are a lot of L fans/supporters so who knows....

[Lust]

kira is god,he juz trying to create a perfect world that is free from criminal,corruption etc...i dont get it why L keep on bothering him...wait is it there no criminal = no job fer him? lol

[silverwolf801]

kira is retarded . I would never serve him. He has already misused the death note to a crazy extent.

[Lust]

kira is retarded . I would never serve him. He has already misused the death note to a crazy extent.
i disagree that with you,yes abuse using it and killing ppl with haxxor power is wrong but L force him to do so thus the master mind is actually L :<

[CallouS]

Oohhh, I didn't catch that it was Dragonball.



Well, Goku still has his tail, which amplifies his power.


It really is an unfair match up, haha.

[CallouS]

Supersaiyan Nappa..Hahahahah.



I just thought that was funny.

Well, Tien would probably win. Ikkaku really has absolutely no chance.

[CallouS]

It wouldn't matter. Bruce Lee is pretty built, is Ichigo?No. He looks like a weasel in his human form. I don't care how good you are at martial arts if your that damn skinny, you won't beat a strong jacked up guy. This is why certain sports have weight classes>.<



What a moron....Of my god. Chuck Norris versus Bruce Lee? Ever see that fight? Chuck Norris is taller than Bruce Lee, also, he has larger muscles, not more defined or ripped, but larger.


Physical Strength can't do shit for you when your knee cap gets popped.

[Silhouette]

Yeah, except Chad's kneecap will never be 'popped' by someone as weak as human Ichigo.

Chad wins, accept it.

[ruzarko]

I like L because he takes stuff as they come to him with hardly any emotion (seems that Byakuya acts the same way now that u think about it :D), and also the fact that hes so smart that he thinks double time meaning that when he thinks of an idea he automatically thinks of a second idea doubting the first O.o in this way its said that L is too smart for his own good (hope that fulfills a little part of the question)

[ruzarko]

anyone who laughs like a maniac and is an egotistical retard doesnt deserve my count :) because he sucks and anyways L rules lol (jus wanted to add that in)

[ruzarko]

id jus do what kira did and destroy all criminals but this time no one could stop me because we dont have L in real life hehehehehe...

[ruzarko]

Ryuk: No i dont have a fetish for apples...

L: I am the leader of the EMO organization

Light: Lets get married L

[Lust]

weirdo that like to eat candies(he certainly must have diabetes :) not to mention how he sit and act) rulez...now thats something ^^

[Lust]

light: i hate death note
L: i hate sweet

[CallouS]

I don't care about this fight, I just caught the Bruce Lee bit.


Any how, technique can overcome strength. Ever hear of Jujitsu? It is a style which focuses on the manipulation of limbs and the reverse of your opponents power. If Ichigo was an avid practitioner of Jujitsu he could Rape Chad. Any how, Chad has no technique. He is only strength, with isn't enough to win fights. Ichigo does practice martial arts, so, he could probably defeat Chad.

[Tobi]

Didn't a metal beam fall on Chad from a massive height and then he just dust himself off? If that didn't break any bones, I don't see how Ichigo could "pop" his knee cap.

[Silhouette]

@CallouS: You don't get it. Its not about skill or technique. You can take a toddler (around 5-7), who's been learning Martial Arts (of any kind) all their life... and they'll still get smacked around by a teenager who doesn't even know what the words 'Martial Arts' means.

Ichigo. Is. Weak. Look at what has happened to Chad. Metal beams, hollow hits, etc. He stopped a giant rolling ball of stone and destroyed it with one punch recently (without his powers).

Ichigo. Can. Not. Hurt. Chad. It doesn't matter what kind of style he's learned. Even if he flips Chad over and gets him to the ground, it wouldn't hurt him.

Chad. Can. Hurt. Ichigo. In a fight where you can't hurt your opponent, but they can probably KO you in 1 or 2 hits. You. Can't. Win. This isn't something where his environment could help either, since *points to steal beam fact*.

It doesn't matter if Ichigo is faster, because he can't hurt Chad. Chad will eventually land a hit on Ichigo, then its over.

I don't think you under the circumstances of this fight. Ichigo can't use his Zanpakuto, or go Bankai. No spirit moves, or uber-building-slicing-strength, no Shunpo. He's in his human form - as is Chad. Chad was always a monster, even before getting reiatsu leaked to him from Ichigo.

Fight over.

[Samanosuke]

Ichigo's punch is not stronger than a metal beam falling from a roof straight to your head.

Ichigo's punch doesn't have more impact than a motorcycle hitting you head on.

Even if it had Chad would stand and smile.

How does Ichigo's actually non existent feats stand a chance in the slightest against someone who rips telephone poles out with ease and strikes hollows with it.

[xCloudswingx]

Yeah i'll go with Chad,
this guy has the strghth to do it!
Ichigo can only give in through his agility.
hmm...

[Tyekanik]

I still don't buy the metal beam bit. Chad's powers were awakened by Ichigo's, however he still had them to some extent. If he had no latent powers would he have still survived?

Humans don't survive steel beams, period. They weight alot, and when things fall force is dramatically increased (why do I feel I should point this out?) If Chad did that with no power whatsoever thngs are already boned. Taking something surpassing human bounds like that and pitting it against a human Ichigo is just out of whack from the get-go.

His power has been there, helping him - just at a low level. Since all he is, is strong, well he had boosted strength/endurance because of the latent powers.

Looking at them both as humans I'm inclined to say Ichigo, Chad would have a hard time getting a good punch in, plus it would be possible for Ichigo to disable Chad much easier than Chad could do so to Ichigo - this is provided Ichigo is doing his best from the start.

Though taking Ichigo's fighting style into account, he'd get hit too many times before getting serious. Which wouldn't work with no spiritual power.

Overall winner: Chad.

[Jay3205]

I think DB world would win, cause several of the more powerful characters have ways of flying, which puts them out of the range of nearly everyone except Gaara and Deidara.

[AymersHuetixz]

Who's the Bleach character you like most???

[Vaddix_XIII]

lets's see if you can guess mine...

[Lust]

gin,byakuya,ichigo,uruhara,grimmjow,ishida,rukia,kaien,ryuuken,ishin,syazel,ulq...and hitsu~not too mention....hollow ichigo/ogihci also old man zangetsu :P
@vad ulq~

[Vaddix_XIII]

gin,byakuya,ichigo,uruhara,grimmjow,ishida,rukia,kaien,ryuuken,ishin,syazel,ulq...and hitsu~not too mention....hollow ichigo/ogihci also old man zangetsu :P
@vad ulq~

lol, quite a few there

btw, yes it is ulq

[Decado]

@Anime mods: Plz do not move this to the Bleach section, or to Bleach randomness. Just close it plox :3

@AymersHuetixz: There's a thread for this here:
http://forums.bleachportal.net/showthread.php?t=17866

[James Cizuz]

Are we forgetting, all the villains would still be existing, during DB time, excluding a few? You said DB universe, though DBZ villains and even some DBGT villains are part of that universe. Though goku and co would be crap, they wouldn't.

Though naruto verse DB planet earth, then yeah, DB loses.

[Slayus]

When L died... that should have been the end of the series imo.... L was Kira's true enemy..... Mello and Near just couldn't fill his shoes in my mind.... Not to mention I wanted Kira to get away with it :D

[Tai Dai]

My favorite character is Grimmjow. then ichigo, aizen, and byakuya are tied for 2nd.

[Graffik]

^^There's already a thread, and yet nobody's closed it as of yet....

And it's a lil' different, as in my favorite Bleach is Javax, My favorite "Bleach" character is Kyoraku, Nell, and other's with similar abilities/personalities

[Psychostar]

My favourite one is Kuchiki Byakuya.

[konakona]

And it's a lil' different, as in my favorite Bleach is Javax
Made me lol

FAV CHAR IS RUKIA

In b4 close

[Cassie]

closed

[ninjabot]

Um, just to be sure...we're all aware that the metal beam fell on post-power Chad, not pre-power Chad, right? Good. Now we remember this is a fight without super powers, right? M'kay. So say again: how does regular non-spiritually aware Chad endure a metal beam falling on him?

He doesn't. So, back to winning a hand-to-hand melee fight with Ichigo without powers. It doesn't happen. It'd be akin to Undertaker vs. Rey Mysterio. Chad swings continuously at well...air. The occasional jab to the nose, kick to the back of the knee or rear naked chokehold would slow him down to punching bag status. I mean, if Chad is just a big normal guy, and Ichigo takes apart entire gangs of normal guys, I'm sure he can pound a slow lummox into submission.

I say it comes down to how many blows Chad can endure, since he'll be taking all the blows this fight. If he can get a bear-hug or chokehold on Ichigo, sure he wins. Just realize he's not 1-hitting a lifelong martial artist.

[Vlad]

Who is good and who is evil is not for me to decide. I am not the one to pass judgement on people, with out giving them chance to change.

Also absolute power like this corrupts absolutely, person possessing death not will kill innocent people with out a doubt.

[Tai Dai]

I don't even like killing bugs, theres no way i could kill a human

[Samanosuke]

..the metal beam fell on post-power Chad, not pre-power Chad, right?

Prove it plz. Unless you can not prove it this is a null argument. Show me a scan where it explicitly states that Chad had spiritual powers around chapter 7 or around there.

Chad was hit by dat metal beam at the beginnin of chapter 7.

Now if you have spiritual powers, shouldn't you be able to see Hollows? Even if you have only a slight ammount of reiatsu, you should at least see a blur space.

Now check dis out:

http://img.bleachexile.com/manga/bleach/009/Bleach-02-02-14.png

Chad didn't see didley dick.

[zan_get_su]

Here is another Death Note Dub Episode...Enjoy

Death Note - 09 -Encounter {C_P}

http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img81/3817/vlcsnap82160rp8.png

MU Link

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=QJ9G2Y30

[Jay3205]

There's nothing to suggest Chad had his powers when the metal beam fell on him. If he had even a small amount of power, he could at least sense the hollow like Ichigo's sister.

Also, even though Ichigo could beat a gang of 5 people or so, that Chad could probably do the same if he actually fought them. Even if he had some spirit powers, he wouldn't get the strength boost until he actually uses them (i.e. manifests the armor).

[watchbleachno]

If you go to www.watchbleachnow.com you can watch every episode of Bleach via stream and download every episode and chapter of manga through either direct download or torrent links! Not to mention all of the bonus material such as character guides, Weapon Guides, and an encyclopedia! Also Live Chat and Forums!!! So what are you waiting for www.watchbleachnow.com :Domo

[watchbleachno]

If you go to www.watchbleachnow.com you can watch every episode of Bleach via stream and download every episode and chapter of manga through either direct download or torrent links! Not to mention all of the bonus material such as character guides, Weapon Guides, and an encyclopedia! Also Live Chat and Forums!!! So what are you waiting for www.watchbleachnow.com

[watchbleachno]

If you go to www.watchbleachnow.com you can watch every episode of Bleach via stream and download every episode and chapter of manga through either direct download or torrent links! Not to mention all of the bonus material such as character guides, Weapon Guides, and an encyclopedia! Also Live Chat and Forums!!! So what are you waiting for www.watchbleachnow.com

[watchbleachno]

If you go to www.watchbleachnow.com you can watch every episode of Bleach via stream and download every episode and chapter of manga through either direct download or torrent links! Not to mention all of the bonus material such as character guides, Weapon Guides, and an encyclopedia! Also Live Chat and Forums!!! So what are you waiting for www.watchbleachnow.:Domo com

[-=Yanayo=-]

wtf is with these threads

[narutoandino]

ichigo baby he knows kung-fu or as i say kickyoass-fu

[Seff vi Britannia]

If narutoverse get demons, you have to say that DB verse can have the dragon, in which case Naruverse is screwed.

[Kuroudo]

yeah but the dragon got killed before, and it dosent fight it just has power to grant wishes (which is totaly uber hax) and i dont think its valid if they go.

Goku: Hey Ryuujin i wish that everbody in the Naruto Uni-verse would be dead!
Dragon: It will be done
MEANWHILE
Jiraya: Hey look at those hot chicks, hey what the ARGHHHARHHGHG HEART ATTACK (Dies)
Goku: heheh (Evil Smile)

also X.Seff.X I claimed you mauhahaha

[Undying]

Wait wait wait!

The thread title is "Narutoverse VS DragonBall".

I don't see anywhere that it states that Narutoverse is going against the Dragonballverse.

Narutoverse VS a single Dragonball?

Dragon ball wins.

You can't crack the dragon's balls.

[SupraSpeed]

what if naruto trys to find the dragon balls??? is that legal? he'd make like 1 million shadow clones and find them before goku does! hahahhahaha

[SupraSpeed]

id have to go with chad on this one.... but then again, i don't think chad and ichigo would ever fight each other.

[Silhouette]

The Dragon cannot grant wishes that bring harm to other people, nubs. They tried that on Raditz.. no, wait... Vegeta and Nappa? *shrug*

Yeah, anyway, that won't work.

As someone else stated before though, DBverse would include the villians. Red Ribbon Army, villians from space - even if they aren't introduced until DBZ.

*coughFriezacough*

^ That's solo-rape btw. Frieza > Narutoverse. Don't argue against that, I'll laugh at you.

But the more you people post here, the more I want to change my vote. Krillin flies into the air, blinds Narutoverse with Solar Flare... then Roshi, Goku, Piccolo, Tien, and maybe Yamcha blast the **** out of everyone - from above.

Can't reach DBverse. Can't even see them due to being blinded. Cheap? So is 200+ vs like 5 people. >.>

[Kuroudo]

we are talking about Dragonball original, not just Dragon ball verse. Only people who have appeared in the original Dragonball no Z no GT. but yes Freiza >>>>> Naruto-Verse. lol 1-hitkill on 9-tailed fox.

[Tai Dai]

Man it's dragon ball z hands down! Can anyone from Naruto destroy the earth with one blast, telepport from one side of the planet to the other, fight so fast no one can see, survive in outer space, fight the strongest villains from the other side of the universe, destroy the moon, turn into an ape that even scares king kong, punch like a meteor without trying I THINK NOT! Dragon Ball Z beats Naruto with just one finger!

[Kuroudo]

Man it's dragon ball z hands down! Can anyone from Naruto destroy the earth with one blast, telepport from one side of the planet to the other, fight so fast no one can see, survive in outer space, fight the strongest villains from the other side of the universe, destroy the moon, turn into an ape that even scares king kong, punch like a meteor without trying I THINK NOT! Dragon Ball Z beats Naruto with just one finger!
DRAGONBALL ONLY, NO DBZ NO DBGT NO MOVIE CHARACTERS OR ABILTIES DRAGONBALL=GOKU ONLY KID-> TEENAGER.

[Silhouette]

we are talking about Dragonball original, not just Dragon ball verse. Only people who have appeared in the original Dragonball no Z no GT. but yes Freiza >>>>> Naruto-Verse. lol 1-hitkill on 9-tailed fox.

Yeah, no. No way in hell the Naruto-Verse gets everyone, while DBverse gets like 5 people.

Frieza was pretty much the cause of Goku going to Earth in the first place. He exists, it doesn't matter if he's shown or not. In which case, also includes Vegeta + Saiyans.

Frieza wins this alone. Fight over? >.>

And you didn't answer my "Krillin + Bomb the **** Out of Everything" strategy. :whatevah:

Let's not forget Goku and his tail = transformation. Yeah, after reading this thread several times, I refuse to give an obviously inferious series (power-wise) the win simply because they have more people.

[Decado]

One-one then?

Let's not forget Goku and his tail = transformation. Yeah, after reading this thread several times, I refuse to give an obviously inferious series (power-wise) the win simply because they have more people.
To that I say, 9-tailed Kyuubi.

[Lelouch]

One-one then?
To that I say, 9-tailed Kyuubi.

What the above user said is correct , Decado. Even if the Kyuubi is enough to beat the Saiyan-Ape ( I doubt it ) , its common sense that enemies like Frieza , ( even Buu , maybe ) could one-hit K.O Narutoverse.

I know they are from DBZ.

But , they existed in the time of DB they just werent shown.
GG.

[Samanosuke]

If it's DB Verse + the villains from outter space (Frieza, King Cold, Sayians etc.), like Cizus mentioned, my vote goes to DB definitely.

[Tai Dai]

DRAGONBALL ONLY, NO DBZ NO DBGT NO MOVIE CHARACTERS OR ABILTIES DRAGONBALL=GOKU ONLY KID-> TEENAGER.

That isn't fair, only goku fighting against all of naruto. Get real, you can't give naruto that much of a handicap.

[Aeolyn]

I probably would use it, and no one would ever suspect me, since I am practically anti-social. (HOOO~)

Too bad it only works for people. I would get rid of English class, the time it takes to reboot my computer, and cat throw up on my bed.

u.u~

[Graffik]

Lol, english class, reboot time

I'd use it b'cuz I'm a psychotic Muther.. and it'd be the perfect tool to spread terror, I'll be legendary... [maniacal laugh] hahahaha

[SenpaiRetsu]

I wouldn't use it, i'd touch it though and examine it. if a shinigami told me the rules and i was informed that there was a heaven i'd immediately get rid of it and be very happy. I'm an athiest and don't believe an heaven and hell. Were i to be informed by something that has been to one or the other and could demonstrate it then i'd gladly live a "sin" free life and try to go to heaven.

[FaerieRose]

I've watched many different anime such as Bleach; Gundam Seed; Gundam Seed Destiny; Fullmetal Alchemist; Ninja Scroll; Escaflowne; Spirited Away; and Howl's Moving Castle to name a few. I read the manga of InuYasha; Hellsing; and Shaman King .

I'm new to the forum and would like to expand my view of the anime and manga because I love to watch as well as read about my favorite characters. I know that a lot of people know more about Bleach than I do currently. I view Bleach from AS and would love to be as caught up in epsidoses as everyone else is that's just not possible for me right now.

If you could share your thoughts on the above mention anime/manga or even add to them. I would greatly appreciate it and thank you in advance for viewing my post too.

Peace-Faerie:biggrinlo

[MooL]

http://forums.bleachportal.net/showthread.php?t=10829

Sorry, there is already a thread on this. Please use the search engine before creating new topics!!

[James Cizuz]

If it's DB Verse + the villains from outter space (Frieza, King Cold, Sayians etc.), like Cizus mentioned, my vote goes to DB definitely.
It has to be, those people existed! Plus they would eventually of made it to earth, ehh radditz, vegeta, nappa, and a few others for example.

[Wren]

Considering Naurto characters cant destroy plannets with extreme fits of yelling loudly, I'm goin to have to say Naurto doesnt stand a chance.

[Wren]

They'd never fight, but I'm sure Chad would knock the crap out of Ichigo

[Wren]

I'd give the win to Ikkaku due to his superior dancing skills.

[Lelouch]

Ikkaku's baldness could easily overpower teh others! pwned!11!11!

Now seriously , Tien would win.

[ninjabot]

Actually, spiritual awareness doesn't just equate to "seeing hollows". The ability to touch something made of spiritual energy is not a trait that normal people have. He sure as heck felt him, which is proof that he had his spiritual powers. If he didn't, he would've had no way of injuring the hollow in the first place, so in actuality, that manga excerpt proved my point for me.

So once again, regular big guy vs. regular light-weight life-time martial artist.

[Guy]

So you hate L and Byakuya fans. OK. That's your opinion. What's up with your attitude though? You made an entire thread just to bash people's opinions?

I like L better than Light because Light is just so hypocritical that he makes me laugh.

[Decado]

So you hate L and Byakuya fans. OK. That's your opinion. What's up with your attitude though? You made an entire thread just to bash people's opinions?
lulz, don't worry about it too much. The fact that the creator of the thread is banned says much about his prestige.
Should be closed :3

[Guy]

No, I would not. I don't want to end up like a crazed hypocrite like Light. If Light were real, I'm sure he would be the world's next Hitler. I don't want to be the world's next Hitler.

[h3h3h3]

Lol N-Luffy dominates horribly.

[Tai Dai]

I like Light better. And why would someone like a person that scratches his feet with his feet in front of guests, and never goes outside and just stays on his computer. I think he needs to get a life. I like Light because he is fearless and scared of no one, like Aizen.

[Joe Black]

L: "You want a piece of me, boy?"
Light: *zergling noises*
Misa: "Do you require medical attention?"
Ryuk: "Did somebody call for an exterminator?"

[Sushi]

Ryuk: Apples suck Light, never buy them again

Light: You know what? screw the death note! This whole thing is getting out of hand, I know I'll get caught, so I might as well give up

L: You know...Kira's sense of justice is better than mine...I think I'll switch

[Samanosuke]

Actually, spiritual awareness doesn't just equate to "seeing hollows". The ability to touch something made of spiritual energy is not a trait that normal people have. He sure as heck felt him, which is proof that he had his spiritual powers. If he didn't, he would've had no way of injuring the hollow in the first place, so in actuality, that manga excerpt proved my point for me.
So once again, regular big guy vs. regular light-weight life-time martial artist.


That's not completely right.
A telephone pole does not have spiritual awareness. Still Chad hit a Hollow with a telephone pole in one of the first 10 Chapters.

[Dokuro]

L: I will never eat strawberry cake again! Never!!

[Dokuro]

:mizuya:No, I will never use that EVIL BOOK.:teu38:
:10:

[James Cizuz]

Lol N-Luffy dominates horribly.
Seriously, if your just going to pull that out of your ass with nothing to back it up go become an hero.

It was clearly shown, multiple threads, and multiple points that luffy loses. Now go troll somewhere else.

[Wren]

L: Propper posture is the key to success in life!

[Seff vi Britannia]

Actually, spiritual awareness doesn't just equate to "seeing hollows". The ability to touch something made of spiritual energy is not a trait that normal people have.

Chapter and page, please?

[Aina1]

L.: hey watari! guess what? i'm gay.

[Anarchy]

Everyone stop lying we are a sick race murder and death is in our genes.

[ninjabot]

Chapter and page where it states normal humans can't touch spiritual energy? Dunno. Quoting wiki is alot less valid, but alot faster than looking for chapters:

Human: The humans of Bleach are much like the residents of modern Japan, and most cannot see or sense disembodied spirits in any way. Spirits can, however, inhabit artificial human bodies called gigai which are visible to ordinary humans. One in 50,000 humans is a medium with some awareness of nearby spirits, but only a third of these are able to see them clearly, and only the strongest of mediums are able to speak with or touch spirits.[1] Certain unique humans naturally have both the power to sense and the strength to fight with spirits. Ordinary humans can gain the ability to interact with spirits by spending time around a large source of spirit energy.

There we go. Only a 3rd of the people that can sense spirits can actually see them. That must mean that they sense them through a manner other than sight, like oh...I dunno...touch maybe? That would explain the whole "punching monsters I can't see" power that Chad has. So I say again: hollow-punching Chad is not normal Chad, it's powered Chad. Chad has no powers in this fight. Now, I don't have an answer for the telephone pole thing, and I'm sure Kubo doesn't either (other than the fact that he forgot the laws of his own manga). But I think it stands to reason we all understand how spirit awareness works, right?

[Undying]

^But a telephone pole doesn't have a spiritual awareness. How will you explain that a telephone pole without any form of spiritual awareness can touch a spirit, unless it's also possible that regular humans can touch ghosts, it's just that without spiritual awareness it's the same as a telephone pole touching them.

Also, I cannot remember anywhere it's stated that only humans with spiritual awareness can touch ghosts. I'm certain that only people with spiritual awareness can contact with ghosts (speak, see, etc.), but touching? Never heard of it.

And only 1 in 50000 should be able to see and talk to shinigami, if I remember right the first chapters. CBF to check, though.

[Seff vi Britannia]

Yeah, wikipedia isn't canon.

[Jay3205]

I'm pretty sure there is no requirement for touching spirits. The mere fact that shinigami and hollows can successfully touch and attack humans suggests that a human could do the same, provided they know where to attack.

[OutLawBankai]

well if you look hollow and stuff have left marks on buildens and stuff so maybe stuff like that they can touch etc

[OutLawBankai]

why dose everyone keep using ichigo when its Ogichi who it fight. anyway

yea luffy maybe stronger then Ogichi but thats where it ends. think off all the stuff that Ogichi can do, kuroi getsuga for one what whould own luff badly then you got his speed (people saying luffy can move at the speed of light is piss if he could move at the speed of light why whould he wanna go by boat lol). in any case the only way luffy whould even have a chance if ogichi was drunk and didnt no where he ws or what he was doing (and tbh he seems like a hardcore drinker :p).

[Kuroudo]

Stop Posting ogichi won already. its pointless to try to revive it.

[James Cizuz]

why dose everyone keep using ichigo when its Ogichi who it fight. anyway
yea luffy maybe stronger then Ogichi but thats where it ends. think off all the stuff that Ogichi can do, kuroi getsuga for one what whould own luff badly then you got his speed (people saying luffy can move at the speed of light is piss if he could move at the speed of light why whould he wanna go by boat lol). in any case the only way luffy whould even have a chance if ogichi was drunk and didnt no where he ws or what he was doing (and tbh he seems like a hardcore drinker :p).
1. Ogichi is ichigo. OGICHI IS NOT STRONGER THEN ICHIGO. Like I stated before, ogichi can access.... Not access is the wrong word... Force beyond limits, though it has a huge toll, breaking bones, etc etc. Also, ogichi can't use more power then ichigo, it's just ichigo doesn't know how to focus all of it, or access the whole range etc.

[Esca]

Err, wrong.

Ogihci is stronger than Ichigo, stated by Ulquirroa.

To be accurate, Ogihci has full access to all of Ichigo's Shinigami and Hollow power, but the shinigami side power will only increase as Ichigo becomes stronger while the Hollow Power is already at max, Ogihci having full access to it. Ichigo is weaker because he's barely tapped into his hollow AND shinigami power while Ogihci has full access to both.

I was typing fast, forgive any typographical and/or grammar errors.

[James Cizuz]

Err, wrong.

Ogihci is stronger than Ichigo, stated by Ulquirroa.

To be accurate, Ogihci has full access to all of Ichigo's Shinigami and Hollow power, but the shinigami side power will only increase as Ichigo becomes stronger while the Hollow Power is already at max, Ogihci having full access to it. Ichigo is weaker because he's barely tapped into his hollow AND shinigami power while Ogihci has full access to both.

I was typing fast, forgive any typographical and/or grammar errors.
Sigh, what did I say? The exact same thing. Ogichi is not, I repeat not stronger then ichigo. He has access to all abilities, as well as all power ichigo obtains, and even though ichigo might reach his full potential it's to much strain on his body.

[Silhouette]

Bottom line; Fighting Ogichi is much harder than fighting Ichigo. So, in a sense, he IS stronger. Faster, more powerful, etc. Because he can use what Ichigo can't.

Ogichi is Ichigo at his MAX potential. Ichigo himself fights at like, probably less than half of what he's truly capable of. So when someone's fighting them, they'll note that Ogichi is stronger - because he's fighting with more power than Ichigo.

Stop being so damn technical. :rolleye09

[Sushi]

They both get lucky all the time. That's why they win 99% of their fights lol

So it comes down to who lucks out more.

I say Ichigo. at least