Question *contains spoilers*

[sinkinswimmer]

Ok, I have a question from the manga, it's in the later chapters, and contains a major spoiler. So if you don't read the manga, you've been warned.

In ch. 176, Aizen uses hadou (kidou) no. 90 (called Black Coffin). Then Aizen talks about how he didn't even hit 1/3 of the spell's full potential, stating how insanely difficult the kidous in the 90's are.

However, in ch. 61 when Ichigo is tranforming into a hollow / shinigami, Tessai uses bakudou (kidou) no. 99 (called Way of Binding No. 99 [type 2]).

The first thing I want to ask, are these kidou's even in the same class? (I think they are...)

If so, what does that say about Urahara and Tessai's real power, if Tessai can cast a kidou no. 99 without breaking a sweat, while Aizen can't fully unleash kidou no. 90?

[DragonBlade]

Did Tessai instantly cast this spell without saying the incantations?

[sinkinswimmer]

well, in the anime, no... in the manga, yes and no he casts the way of binding no 99, and that's all he says... a couple chapters later, tessai does the incantation.


also, in the manga, it's pretty obvious that hollow ichigo is the one who escapes from shattered shaft....

[uraharachan]

Tessais nuts. Him and Urahara and just plain crazy strong...

[yukino_silvermaine]

maybe the target also affects the spell??? i mean... Aizen used the kidou on a captain and tessai just used it on non-shinigami Ichigo. i dunno... >_< maybe hadou and kidou are different. maybe hadou is a specialized type of kidou that requires more power or somethin' ...

[cook32]

hmmm... this is just my understanding... so it could be wrong :P
kidou - the general term for all kinds of spells
hadou - attacking spell
bakudou - binding spell

so even though in terms of difficulty 99 pwns 90, but hadou is for attacking and bakudou is binding, so you can't really compare them like that?

and another thing: when tessai first used it, it's just no. 99 kin, but when he use it the 2nd time its the badass 'ban' ('ban' as in bankai) version with full chanting ^^

so yeah, i guess urahara and tessai pwns all ^^

[sinkinswimmer]

i'm pretty sure you're right about hadou and bakudou being different. but how a binding spell holds up in difficultly compared to an attack spell... who knows?

[susanowa]

Hello. I'm new.

Hello.I'm new.

[AltoK]

Yo ! I'm happy I found this thread.
That is indeed strange that Tessai is able to cast what seems to be a very strong spell (classified 99).

I also think Bakudo spells are classified, as well as Hadou spells, by level.
The required power to cast or to maintain Bakudo spells is very certainly determined by the spiritual strenght of the target (Rukia couldn't maintain her Bakudo spell against GF for very long).

There seems to be a great difference between casting a Kidou spell normally and casting a chantless Kidou spell. In that case, it seems that Tessai must have chanted the incantation (Ichigo become aware that his arms are tied only after a while, which should mean he was unconscious for a while).
The fact that he didn't chant anything to activate the different parts doesn't mean it's chantless, because the whole spell could be prepared with only the base incantation (the one that casts the spell).
And, finally, there could be some modifications in the Shattered Shaft made for Tessai not to have a too unpleasant time maintaining his spell...

Either way, maintaining a 99-classified Bakudo spell during 70 hours must require quite a strenght.
Well done, Tessai-san !

[Polygon]

It was called way of binding. So it could be that the numbers hold no relavance. But we don't know if this holds true.

Either way any kidoh with the number 99 is extremley immpressive. We saw that he had already complete;d the kidoh on Ichigo, and most likley he did it chantless. As there is no reason that he then would have had mentioned the spell at all if he alreay did.

The spell itself seems to be comprised of 3 parts. One where it binds the arms, the other wiere it sticks a bunch of needles into you and the last a huge box appeared crashing down on the target. Unless the ast part was a destructive spell.

To have had known 99 he must know al the spells before 99. And its obvios he knows destructive spells as well. As it would be completley Idiotic for him to know so many Bakudo spells and not know any Hadou.

He also can out of the pit unscathed. And its bovious ichigo had hollow help to get out. I don't actually think a normal ichigo even now wold have had survived. And then there is also that maybe tessi wasn't going his all becaue Urahara tols him to stop, but he couldn't.

He also brushed Ururu ingenocide mode is if it was nthing.

---------

I atually have a theory that he might have had been the commander of the Demon Arts Brigade, like how Yourichi was commander of the Seceret Mobile Corps.

[AltoK]

"To have had known 99 he must know al the spells before 99. And its obvios he knows destructive spells as well."

Is that so ? I don't see why he must know the 98 other spells below 99.
It's quite obvious he must know some Hadou, but it's not necessary. He seems more like the barehanded fighter type to me (Bakudo can be very useful even in barehanded combat), rather than a Hadou user. If he knows Hadou spells, would he have much use of these ?

If your statement's true, Aizen should know at least 90 Hadou spells (and, necessarily, Bakudo spells : he's a Captain, after all, and Captains pass a difficult test to become Captains !). Frightening !

[Polygon]

Is that so ? I don't see why he must know the 98 other spells below 99.
It's quite obvious he must know some Hadou, but it's not necessary. He seems more like the barehanded fighter type to me (Bakudo can be very useful even in barehanded combat), rather than a Hadou user. If he knows Hadou spells, would he have much use of these ?

If your statement's true, Aizen should know at least 90 Hadou spells (and, necessarily, Bakudo spells : he's a Captain, after all, and Captains pass a difficult test to become Captains !). Frightening !

You misunderstood. I never said he had to know 1-99 of hadou. But he doesn know 1-99 Bakudo ( for the most part)

I'm just saying that he has to know some Hadou. Just because some people say he knows no hadoh.

[AltoK]

I understood, that he has to know the 1-99 spells of Bakudo.
Well, seems I misunderstood, sorry.

About Tessai not knowing any Hadou spell, that's very unlikely, but not impossible. We just don't know anything about Tessai's abilities. (Please, Kubo-san, make Tessai appear more often !)

[Undying]

Why would KT-sensei want to make Tessai sappear more often? If he can't bind Hollow Ichigo in place (though I believe that the help that Ichigo got from HollowIchigo was nothing more than instrengthening him above Tessai's level, i.e. C level) he can't bind the Arrancar... So... Why do we need him? BTW, it would seem, by the Manga, that Hadous generally are not only more powerful then thire respective Bakudou cousins, but are also harder to perform. That's why Aizen couldn't do more than 1/3 of the Kidous level.

[AltoK]

Uh, in case you haven't noticed, Tessai did maintain his spell for 70 hours before Hollow Ichigo appeared.
70 hours, 3 days without sleeping, seemingly without eating (so he couldn't recover his spiritual strenght), seemingly without moving a milimeter as well, and in a boring damn deep hole.
He must not be as weak as you seem to think him to be.

[Undying]

I didn't say he was weak. Maintaining the binding on spmeone without Shinigami powers is quite different form maintaining the it on a bunch of captain killers, no, AltoK-san? That he maintained it on Ichigo for 3 days is indeed a feat few could achieve (even if they had sufficient strength, I doubt they'd had the patience), but... As I said, I believe that the Hollow increased Ichigo's power to captain level, and he shattered the spell quite effortlessly. See the difference?